what all is going on there? lots of coolness, that's what. what cheesy outro music did i pick this time? something canadian.
you'll just have to wait for the commit digest for more specifics than that. or install kde4 today and find out first hand. granted, you don't get cheesy outro music selected by your truly that way, but you can't have everything. =)
23 comments:
Looks promising, don't forget to also make it available on youtube or something.
A rather offtopic questions, does the current Plasma concept include some kind of application GUI script idea?
Something like having a core application object that then can be used by different GUI scripts?
This would allow for something like having a shared core and multiple profiles according to the use (like using kate on a media center would have a different interface from the normal desktop but the core is the same). (it's somewhat similar to the plasmoids concept)
> does the current Plasma concept include
> some kind of application GUI script idea
if i understand what you're asking, yes ... this is central to the whole plasma concept.
hi aroon, just a question: rotating the applets with the new button results in a bad quality draw of the applet itself.. is this going to be fixed with anti alias? bye, thanx, all the kde team is going to do a great job! :)
piivi (http://piivi.wordpress.com)
Finally, the new panel arrived. Now connecting with this mysterious plasma dashboard it looks wow ;)
I know the Plasma desktop has those really neat plasmoids that have a data engine and a script for defining their appearence. However from what I've read so far I don't understand how it will relate to an application's GUI (except for Amarok's middle plasma thingie) and that's my real question.
I also know that 4.0 won't have everything you're planning, that's why I'm asking in terms of concept.
Ok, the real question is if you have something of this kind planned:
I've read some suggestions in kde-look of what they call "Object-Oriented Desktops"
links:
http://www.kde-look.org/content/show.php/Another+take+on+Object-Oriented+Desktops?content=69144
http://www.kde-look.org/content/show.php/Applying+Object+Orientation+to+Desktop?content=67523
To me they sound complicated and complex but (if I'm interpreting it right) it's just a neat editor for a scriptable application GUI which is just an extension of the Plasma concept but for the whole desktop applications (non-plasmoids, like kwrite, konqueror, etc).
Example using Amarok:
It would have a core application that provides objects (data structures and methods) that can then be used by scripts. These scripts would define the application's real GUI (how the user sees the buttons, playlist etc).
So the script would define everything from the menu items, toolbars, playlist style, etc. but the core is the same for all scripts.
This could also help usability since the GUI is defined in a script (profile?), they could be easily shared and everyone would chose the one they like more.
Example:
Someone familiar with GNOME would rather have a simplified version of Kate instead of all those options. An old KDE user would rather keep them all available (in some menu or whatever).
In this model, the applications core is the same only the script/profile defines what is shown or not.
Distributions would then be encourage to just mess with these GUI scripts and leave the core app to the main contributors (or submit patches, obviously).
You could also have a block/LEGO like application to build these scripts by linking components/widgets, etc. like those kde-look suggestions.
Some apps could allow you to drag and drop menu entries onto the app's toolbar and stack the action to combine their functions, like save and exit, multiple save targets (local and remote - backup), etc. but underneath it's all just a script using the app core functions.
Some silly use cases:
For example, you could just drag and drop Amarok's analyzers to the taskbar, right click edit script and make it only show when Amarok is running some special music. Better yet, make so a weather applet gets the current atmosferic conditions where you are and then selects a desktop theme and music playlist accordingly. The second might be just for fun but the first could help with the ambient light like if it's cloudy you might like a less bright theme/contrast.
Also imagine you have a laptop that is used both at home and work and also as a media center.
When you are in desktop mode you have all traditional layouts but when you're at work it changes all defaults to reflect that. Akregator only fetches important security news but not slashdot, Kopete only connects to the company's chat server instead of gtalk and messenger and development applications change their layout to reflect your current project so you have a list of files that doesn't include pet projects, Amarok chooses some more calm and less distracting music.
With the same laptop you then connect it at home to your tv just to watch a movie. The desktop changes to a reduced mode where every app only shows the most common operations and all buttons are larger and everything is more pretty with media center like desktop effects. All applications are the same at the core, just the GUI script changes to reflect the current situation.
You then clone your personal settings to an Eee PC. When you load it, it changes to a small screen mode where everything is simplistic and adequate to a small screen, some widgets can be just a small transparent icon that will zoom in when it receives focus (like those itens in the dock on OS X) instead of using lot of screen space as in the desktop mode.
Since I still see the Plasma analog clock in its original incarnation: I'm a bit concerned that the digits of the analog clock still look wrong and misaligned. I already posted a detailed comment on that, but it either did not get noticed or was not deemed worthy:
http://blog.ruphy.org/posts/18#comment-592
So to the Plasma supervisor himself, try a simple Google image search, find something like this,
http://pcwin.com/media/images/screen/78460-clock_.jpg
or this
http://widgets.opera.com/widget/screenshot/large/3529/1.0/
compare these to the layout of the plasma clock and tell me if its spacing just looks _wrong_.
I guess a fix would catapult its look into new heights, even if you haven't noticed the odd look before.
Hi Aaron!
Did you see that Fedora 8 comes with a Wallpaper changing color during the day? (Gnome :/)
Don't you think this would be a good small feature for KDE 4.x?
Opensource is sharing idea, and I find this one pretty good.
Thanks for your cool news Aaron :D
@anonymous: "rotating the applets with the new button results in a bad quality draw of the applet itself"
known issue. we'll see what we can do about it, though our options are somewhat limited. at least it's already a LOT better now that we actually resize the applets rather than just scale them with a transformation matrix ;)
@Mkbart: thanks =) and what's really interesting is that this all tip of the iceberg stuff. this is just to get us to the starting point and then things really get fun. i'm still going to bring things like the moving timeline plasmoid, autonetworking and discovery and more ...
@Anonymous: "Object-Oriented Desktops"
i think we're moving in that direction, though not quite in the way you describe. rather than having applications that are manhandled by scripts, i expect to see applications to start to come in much smaller "pieces". they'll still be coherent wholes and may even all be interconnected in the back, but the interfaces will become more and more a collection of interchangeable items.
it's not particularly to be able to mix and match within an application, imho, as a good designer can do better than most of us on one of their bad days. it's when you can mix and match between applications.
nepomuk+strigi is one piece of this puzzle from the data semantics side; plasma is a piece of the puzzle from a interface flexibility side; things like akonadi are paret of the puzzle from a data provider abstraction side; etc..
we're years from being there, but it is very plausable that the trend has been put in motion here.
@Anonymous: "the digits of the analog clock still look wrong and misaligned"
most of the artwork in plasma sucks right now. i don't like most any of it. i hope to sit down with the artists for a day or two in the next little while here to get some *good* art together.
@Temet:
"Did you see that Fedora 8 comes with a Wallpaper changing color during the day? (Gnome :/)"
yes. and it's amazingly badly designed. omg. if you look at the file that describes the images one has to wonder what 12 year old came up with the technical side of it.
it's also really, really trivial. kde3 had things that changed with the time of day (kworldclock anyone?)
"Don't you think this would be a good small feature for KDE 4.x?"
a slideshow is already there.. a time-of-day thing will likely come. we can do so much more than that though with containments. if the best we come up with is an image that changes on the time of day, we suck ;)
WOW THE TASKBAR ROCKS!!!!!!!! :D
i'm so happy with this, thanks for whoever implemented it :)))
the new panel's gorgeous. Looks like Nuno's vision became a reality!
:x
In fact I didn't see it (the Fedora changing wallpaper), just eard about it.
I didn't know it was just a dirty hack.
Sorry dude :'(
There is the option to switch to the panel of Beta 4?I really don't like this panel.
@Benton XVI: "There is the option to switch to the panel of Beta 4"
you want a panel that doesn't lay things out proper? or just one that doesn't support proper theming? ;) kidding. actually, you can replace the svg with any thing you want. the current one is just a placeholder.
Is the taskbar design final for 4.0? Judging by the picture it looks like the KMenu/Kickoff button doesn't extend to the corners of the screen thus making a usually trivial action (opening the menu) an excercise in pointing with the mouse. Even if it does extend to the screen corners the visual representation hints the opposite.
Erunno
My doubt is whether the panel is the final version.
I like more the "normal" panel.
@Temet:
The changing gnome wallpaper of Fedora can be downloaded for kde from here: http://rdieter.livejournal.com/3699.html where it is called kdesktop-infinity-0.2
@anonymous: "Is the taskbar design final for 4.0?"
no. funny: i show things that weren't possible before (rounded corners and distinct edges on non-fullwidth panels) and instead people complain about full width panels; yeesh! ;)
"Judging by the picture it looks like the KMenu/Kickoff button doesn't extend to the corners of the screen thus making a usually trivial action (opening the menu) an excercise in pointing with the mouse."
on a centerered, non-100%-width panel you don't get that (by definition ;) on a 100% panel or left justified panel you do.
that's actually whey i spent time on the weekend implementing per-side margins in plasma layouts.
@anonymous: "Is the taskbar design final for 4.0?"
no. funny: i show things that weren't possible before (rounded corners and distinct edges on non-fullwidth panels) and instead people complain about full width panels; yeesh! ;)
Good news anyway :) .
"no. funny: i show things that weren't possible before (rounded corners and distinct edges on non-fullwidth panels) and instead people complain about full width panels; yeesh! ;)"
Maybe a less "almost full width" panel would get your point better across without raising questions about the usability of the panel ;-) But I can see that this setup will be necessary to implement some of the Raptor mockups. Anyway, at this stage of development it's not that far off to consider every screenshot a final design for 4.0 :-)
Erunno
rounded corners... sweet
Will KDE 4 still support the option for a Mac style menu bar?
If it will, might it be a little more functional than it is right now? There are some wonky issues with the system tray being cut off and such. I think it's nice to have an option for this type of single menu bar, as OS X is the other system I use, it makes life much easier to have some consistency!
Keep up the fantastic work, I can hardly wait for KDE 4!
I love that song, and I'm loving your work! *generic supportive/appreciative comment* :P
First, congrats for the recent advances on Plasma.
One question which I want to ask you is if there will be desktop icons in Plasma?
I remember there were a desktop applet on playground or extragear, but right now it is commented on it's CMakeLists.txt, and I'm not sure if desktop icons was one of the plasma's goals.
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